maudlin of the well interview thread four Exposé: I've read articles on MotW where the writers seem determined in some way or another to find out what your songs mean, as in an exposition of the lyrical content. It seems clear for yourselves and other similarly minded bands that the intent of the lyrics is not to give some sort of literal rendering, but rather to touch on subjects with a certain amount of mystery and room for multi-interpretation. Would this be correct? What type of intent do(es) the lyric writer(s) have for the listeners in the writing, especially in light of the writing obviously being informed by esoteric interests? Byron: All of the poetry that I have been lucky enough to have used in motW songs is more literal, I think, than ambiguous. The subject matter is concrete, only dressed in flowery language to give a sort of mystique to it. The poetry on these two albums was very therapeutic for me at the time of the writing, and its only use for me was to lift the veil that had been prohibiting my mental and spiritual growth. It's kind of funny, I think, that when I go back and re-read the words to "The Garden Song" or "They Aren't All Beautifull," I can remember how painful it was to write them, to drudge up really shitty things I didn't want to think about, but as soon as they were out, the therapy had been done, and I no longer cared about those things. I like to think of these songs as a possible aid to others who may now feel the way that I did. And I pray some might even find inspiration through my own and overcome some of their own blocks. As far as "esoteric interests" are concerned, I've been leaning more and more in that direction. "Birth Pains of Astral Projection," I think, acted as a kind of door, an introduction to something that goes much deeper than many people realize. I wrote probably close to 20 poems during this past August and September, and they are absolutely nothing like anything I have ever written. The direction of my passion has shifted to a much more "dreamy" state, and I feel a more personal connection toward these than any of my older material. I think this explanation will suffice: "Birth P..." deals with the idea of not only leaving the body, but the whole unraveling of the mysteries of the secret sciences. This song acts as a kind of "gate" to where my newer inspiration springs; it is mostly written from the point-of-view of the body of light, the astral double, and it is written in a way that is very open to interpretation, because the astral is very plastic, very moldable. Exposé: There is sort of this overlap that happens once an album is released, because often the artist's perspective has graduated to the next event, while the consumer is listening to a number of songs that were written in earlier years. Where has motW come since the recording of Bath and Leaving Your Body Map? What is the new material like and how has the process changed (if at all) for the work on the new material? Toby: I think very basically, we're a much, much better live band than we were in the past, which is really important to the vibe of a group and how much everyone enjoys being a part of the project. Now as far as writing, there's been an advancement that feels huge to me. The way I work is that I'll come out with a bunch of music, and then I'll record it. During the entire process of recording I force myself not to write because I'll impulsively want to record those songs as part of the then-current project. This is bad, because the music needs time to settle. So then usually after the project is done, lots and lots of music will just pour out of me because it had been building up for so long. I wrote nothing during the recording process of Bath and LYBM except for our secret song, which we recorded just very recently for an outtake. That song was weird because it was like lagged from the Bath/LYBM music. It belonged with those albums, so it was something that accidentally showed up while we were recording. I sat on it for a year though before we recorded it. Anyway, after the albums came out I began writing again, and everything that was coming out was pretty, and sounded nice but something was wrong, I didn't like any of it. I was producing music that was fun to play in my room on an acoustic but it felt like it should just be confined to there and to that moment. I got bummed and thought I was blocked. Then suddenly, one night as I was messing around in my room, I had this amazing compositional epiphany and I suddenly realized exactly what I wanted to say musically, and how it differed from the previous music that we had. There were these really obvious things now that I can't understand how I didn't miss them before. It's like I understand music better and on some other kind of level, like an even higher plane of inspiration. OK, so, what does it sound like? Very organic, I would say, it breathes very deeply. It's eye-contact based, rhythm and meter have been lost, riffs are virtually non-existent, like in my view of classical music, that it just begins and ends, and there's no silly messing about on a riff. My epiphany has even made me come to really hate the concept of a riff and all the music that I once liked that is riff based is starting to bug me. Which really sucks too, because I want to like that music, but I can't get over the fact that it bothers me now. It's like when I listened to the new My Dying Bride album - I can't even tell if it's good. I don't like it, all I hear is riff, riff, riff, but to someone who's into that, I have no idea anymore if it's good. It's frustrating. As far as working the music for a band, I think we're going to do it the same way we did the last one, with the maps. The idea though is to keep it minimal as far as instrumentation goes (but still big, like 20 guitars instead of 20 different instruments maybe). The vibe of the record is going to remain consistent throughout, it'll be a short little treasure of dark art. I think you'd find on the next album that all the songs are going to sound pretty similar to one another, but not in a redundant way. I think probably just texturally. It's still in it's early stages. Byron can tell you about his lyrical epiphany which, oddly, coincided perfectly with my musical one. Byron: I feel that we have been building up to something. I have looked back on my writing style and how it has been influenced over the years, and changed, and I have noticed that I have been doing a lot of "chameleon work"; I have been more or less imitating whomever I have been reading at a given time. It's really irritating! I think I've finally found my own style, however, as a synthesis of my more major influences. For me, at least, my work has changed drastically. Well, my ideas. I've been focusing more and more on spirituality and philosophy, and it is changing my life. I'm dealing with subjects that I've always wanted to write about, but was both never good enough to deal with them satisfactorily, (According to my own standards, of course. Everyone else can go suck one!) and unable to even communicate what I've been thinking to myself in concrete terms even in my conscious mind. It's kind of difficult to explain. As far as the music itself is concerned, it's developing extraordinarily, with the little I've heard so far. It's a lot more abstract, and it tends to follow more "classical" guidelines, without the silly distorted guitar accompanied by a full orchestra cliché. It's ... different. I think it's awesome, but I'm also biased. :) Sam: Toby if you're looking to unload any of those CDs I'll take 'em... :) Well, just to differ from Toby on this one - I tend to view riff-based and non-riff-based music as very separate entities, as modes of composition not unlike genres. While I recognize the straightforwardness of the "riff" approach, some of the music that most affects me emotionally falls into the basic pop song structure. Like Paul Simon. Most of his songs fall into the ABABCAB structure, but they're genius, in my opinion. And, of course it is the foundation that metal music is built upon. Metallica, Iron Maiden, Megadeth (who are perhaps the most blatantly guilty of using Verse-Chorus-Verse-Chorus-Guitar Solo-Verse-Chorus of anyone), Black Sabbath, it's just the way the genre is, by and large. And of course there are counter-examples - Esoteric comes to mind, but for the most part it's the way it is. I guess basically my point is that I don't view non-riff music as inherently superior or more interesting. It's a method of working that faces the same challenges as all other music. Toby: I didn't mean that one was superior or inferior, just the preference of the year for me. Expose: I find it both amazing and inspiring that such a large group can be in such alignment with one member who seems to be the primary composer. I'm interested to hear from (any of) the rest of the members what it is like to see the compositions in an early stage and the type of inspiration that such a flow of music causes, particularly in reaction to the work of both Toby and Byron. Because it seems clear that the outer face of motW is of a composite ensemble rather than the elaboration of a solo album or individual's work. Greg: Well the way I view it is that we're really a band made up of individualistic musicans and composers. I think that stems from our beginnings as a studio project of Toby's where Toby recorded a song and had us come in to elaborate. So to me, we all were doing our own things and what have you, but Toby's was the project that seemed like it would actually be going somewhere so the idea was to help pursue this project and see where it would lead us. Hence why we then made the leap into doing gigs and moving in together, etc. It was all for the sake of pursuing the original project and along the way we have grown into a more collaborative band atmosphere. We all contribute small ideas to the songs that Toby presents us with, or Terran, in the case of "The Ferryman." As for hearing the songs in the early stages, I will honestly admit that I am typically not usually into hearing the songs in those early stages. Not because they aren't good but because I usually can't hear what Toby is hearing in his head, and it's hard for me to grasp from one guitar part where the song will be going. I have always tried to approach my view of the music as the "outsider looking in." I approach it like a music fan, and I try to have a healthy outlook on it so that as it grows I imagine what it would be like hearing it as a casual listener and trying to let it affect me the way my favorite music usually does. I find that to be helpful since I really am not as close to the songs as Toby is. So for me it's like imagining my favorite band and getting to add solos to the songs and play the songs live which is a really amazing feeling. Although since we have been living together that viewpoint as shifted a bit as I have found myself more at ease with hearing the newer songs in their infantile stages, because I feel they communicate very well to me in that format whereas with the older stuff where you hear all the layers, hearing those basic guitar parts didn't hit me as much. I think it's really a testament to the strength of the writing in its ability to communicate with the listener on so many different levels, whether it's the grand kind of layered pieces we have done in the past or the newer material which can communicate very strongly with just one guitar part (for now at least). The same is true of Byron's lyrics and the way he has grown with it. He really has learned to communicate so well with his words and the way they evoke emotion in the reader or listener. Byron is hands down my favorite lyricist ever. So in closing, despite being a very minute part of the creative process of Maudlin just being able to see Toby and Byron's minds at work has really been inspirational for me as a composer and writer on my own in helping me understand the way music and words can work to communicate to the listener and to be an emotional catharsis for the writer. And as a performer/soloist it has made me a better musician by giving me the added challenge of coming up with lead ideas which hopefully play off of the music and lyrics and make a coherent comment on the song which is in line with what the music is trying to say, so I don't sound like a wanker throwing any old lead idea on there to have a solo. continued > thread five